One thing I don't get with "But the room doesn't exist, so they should have known!" is how much it's assuming people think the hosts are competent (or perfect, everyone makes mistakes).
If I see what looks like an interesting panel in a room I can't find a name for I'm going to first assume I'm reading the map wrong/have overlooked it, then I'm going to assume that someone's screwed up and either it's not on the map, or they've put down the wrong name - or not the "wrong" name, but something that's known locally/traditionally as one thing, but that's not the room on the door.
Anecdote time: Organising school events, we had to fight older teachers who wanted to put "Upstairs in the New Block" on their leaflets with the argument "Everyone knows the New Block". Except... it's not officially called NB, doesn't say that on the map, doesn't say that on the door. And it hasn't been new since the 60s. And when you're running an event for outside people... it doesn't matter what the locals call it, it matters what it says on the map and the door. So for something like a con I might assume Stagg Field was the nickname for a room, possibly based on a humorous event several years ago.
A lot of this strikes me as "Let's exclude people who don't know as much as us (like a character from an American TV show that stopped running in 1995)" type of snobbery at it finest.
(You know, I don't even know why I care about this - I'm not American, I'm not a con-goer. But possibly that's why - because even if this were in London... I get a distinct sense it's being marked as Not For People Like Me. Which is fine, except when they say it's for everyone.)
When I was an undergraduate, the student health services were officially known as the University Health Services, and unofficially but almost universally called "DUH" (pronounced as the three letters, not "duh") for their previous name. This information was in the freshman orientation materials, so we would know what the older students, faculty, and staff were talking about. (It also had the effect of perpetuating the nickname: I don't think anyone called it "UHS" in conversation.)
On a larger scale: after half a century, the city government gave in and put the "Sixth Avenue" signs back up in Manhattan, on the street that they had renamed "Avenue of the Americas" in the 1930s, because locals never really accepted the change, and tourists were getting lost when they got directions that included Sixth Avenue. And "Sixth Avenue is between Seventh and Fifth" is relatively obvious. (There are now pairs of signs, one with each name.)
By the time I was there, there had been two new additions since the New Block and they were working on a third, but... it had the nickname, and the nickname stuck. Because that's how people work. But the problem is - as observed with cons and with your Manhattan example, it only works if everyone is in on it.
Case in point--one of the places that I frequently go for physical therapy is called one thing on all of the letterhead and by all of the receptionists. For this post, call it "St. Joseph Care" or "St. Joseph's Hospital." However, the official name of the place is...well, something along the lines of "Cedars-Riverton Rehabilitation Hospital." I got into quite a lot of trouble with Dial-A-Ride for using the name on the letterhead, because when DAR looked up the address I gave them, St. Joseph Care had a completely different address--that of the main hospital half a town away. The rehab hospital had never changed its name after the two entities merged.
So if someone told me that a room was in the Stagg Field room, I would assume that something like that was going on...an unofficial and frequently used name like vs. the official one. Sixth Avenue vs. Avenue of the Americas, in other words. If I didn't see it on the map, I'd think that the map was old or that the map I had had been drawn wrong. If none of the employees knew about the room--hey, maybe they're new and just don't know everything about the hotel yet. It happens.
Until I saw the post about WorldCon in Chicago, I'd never heard of "practical joke tracks" of panels that were printed up in official materials. I never would have assumed that such a thing was a practical joke because:
1) Practical jokes are mean-spirited and are intended to make fun of someone.
2) Making fun of people who have paid $200 to attend a convention is not good business.
3) Putting people in varying degrees of health, some of whom have problems dealing with physical and emotional stress, and some of whom suffer considerable physical pain as a result of physical stress, is not good business.
4) Anything in the official materials would have to have been approved by those in charge. This sets a tacit seal of approval on everything.
5) Putting an implied seal of approval on a mean-spirited action that mocks paying customers while causing them to waste their time, to suffer unnecessary physical and emotional stress, AND to risk enduring hours or even days of exhaustion and/or debilitating pain is not good business.
Yes, I know that the organizers are volunteers. But if it would come across as mean and petty and hurtful if a business did it or if the government did it, then it's no better if geeks do it.
I don't even know why anyone has to say any of this to the organizers of WorldCon. Treating customers LIKE customers and not like potential targets of ridicule seems mind-bogglingly obvious to me.
(Sasha, you know because it's in your journal but am reposting here for people who didn't see.)
It's been pointed out that actually, Stagg Field is on a map.
There's a PDF here which not very clearly shows Stagg Field marked on the bronze level between Wrigley and Soldier Field - look just above the blue line, where it says Gopher HQ in black.
So all the "Well they should have known it didn't exist because it wasn't on the map!" is now bullshit.
(I left a comment on the other post with the link - other people have already pointed it out, but so people can see for themselves.)
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(no subject)
Date: 2012-09-07 08:21 am (UTC)If I see what looks like an interesting panel in a room I can't find a name for I'm going to first assume I'm reading the map wrong/have overlooked it, then I'm going to assume that someone's screwed up and either it's not on the map, or they've put down the wrong name - or not the "wrong" name, but something that's known locally/traditionally as one thing, but that's not the room on the door.
Anecdote time: Organising school events, we had to fight older teachers who wanted to put "Upstairs in the New Block" on their leaflets with the argument "Everyone knows the New Block". Except... it's not officially called NB, doesn't say that on the map, doesn't say that on the door. And it hasn't been new since the 60s. And when you're running an event for outside people... it doesn't matter what the locals call it, it matters what it says on the map and the door. So for something like a con I might assume Stagg Field was the nickname for a room, possibly based on a humorous event several years ago.
A lot of this strikes me as "Let's exclude people who don't know as much as us (like a character from an American TV show that stopped running in 1995)" type of snobbery at it finest.
(You know, I don't even know why I care about this - I'm not American, I'm not a con-goer. But possibly that's why - because even if this were in London... I get a distinct sense it's being marked as Not For People Like Me. Which is fine, except when they say it's for everyone.)
(no subject)
Date: 2012-09-07 11:41 am (UTC)When I was an undergraduate, the student health services were officially known as the University Health Services, and unofficially but almost universally called "DUH" (pronounced as the three letters, not "duh") for their previous name. This information was in the freshman orientation materials, so we would know what the older students, faculty, and staff were talking about. (It also had the effect of perpetuating the nickname: I don't think anyone called it "UHS" in conversation.)
On a larger scale: after half a century, the city government gave in and put the "Sixth Avenue" signs back up in Manhattan, on the street that they had renamed "Avenue of the Americas" in the 1930s, because locals never really accepted the change, and tourists were getting lost when they got directions that included Sixth Avenue. And "Sixth Avenue is between Seventh and Fifth" is relatively obvious. (There are now pairs of signs, one with each name.)
(no subject)
Date: 2012-09-07 11:47 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-09-07 03:30 pm (UTC)Case in point--one of the places that I frequently go for physical therapy is called one thing on all of the letterhead and by all of the receptionists. For this post, call it "St. Joseph Care" or "St. Joseph's Hospital." However, the official name of the place is...well, something along the lines of "Cedars-Riverton Rehabilitation Hospital." I got into quite a lot of trouble with Dial-A-Ride for using the name on the letterhead, because when DAR looked up the address I gave them, St. Joseph Care had a completely different address--that of the main hospital half a town away. The rehab hospital had never changed its name after the two entities merged.
So if someone told me that a room was in the Stagg Field room, I would assume that something like that was going on...an unofficial and frequently used name like vs. the official one. Sixth Avenue vs. Avenue of the Americas, in other words. If I didn't see it on the map, I'd think that the map was old or that the map I had had been drawn wrong. If none of the employees knew about the room--hey, maybe they're new and just don't know everything about the hotel yet. It happens.
Until I saw the post about WorldCon in Chicago, I'd never heard of "practical joke tracks" of panels that were printed up in official materials. I never would have assumed that such a thing was a practical joke because:
1) Practical jokes are mean-spirited and are intended to make fun of someone.
2) Making fun of people who have paid $200 to attend a convention is not good business.
3) Putting people in varying degrees of health, some of whom have problems dealing with physical and emotional stress, and some of whom suffer considerable physical pain as a result of physical stress, is not good business.
4) Anything in the official materials would have to have been approved by those in charge. This sets a tacit seal of approval on everything.
5) Putting an implied seal of approval on a mean-spirited action that mocks paying customers while causing them to waste their time, to suffer unnecessary physical and emotional stress, AND to risk enduring hours or even days of exhaustion and/or debilitating pain is not good business.
Yes, I know that the organizers are volunteers. But if it would come across as mean and petty and hurtful if a business did it or if the government did it, then it's no better if geeks do it.
I don't even know why anyone has to say any of this to the organizers of WorldCon. Treating customers LIKE customers and not like potential targets of ridicule seems mind-bogglingly obvious to me.
(no subject)
Date: 2012-09-07 10:36 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-09-07 02:44 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-09-08 08:33 am (UTC)It's been pointed out that actually, Stagg Field is on a map.
There's a PDF here which not very clearly shows Stagg Field marked on the bronze level between Wrigley and Soldier Field - look just above the blue line, where it says Gopher HQ in black.
So all the "Well they should have known it didn't exist because it wasn't on the map!" is now bullshit.
(I left a comment on the other post with the link - other people have already pointed it out, but so people can see for themselves.)
(no subject)
Date: 2012-09-08 05:01 pm (UTC)